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Community Christian Church
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Roderick Grant



Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 9298

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

True, it's hard to find much to praise in this mess. Even the original design, had it been executed with extreme care, was a bit blocky and un-church-like. Little wonder why it has never garnered any attention.
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DRN



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3768
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Even the original design, had it been executed with extreme care, was a bit blocky and un-church-like.


I agree. The church looks to me like a derivation of Wright's "New Theater" for Woodstock, NY from the late '20's.
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SDR



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 17791
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Fri Aug 04, 2017 5:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The New Theater, Woodstock, NY, 1931 (project).


















© 2009 by TASCHEN GmbH and by the Frank Lloyd Wright Foundation
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DavidC



Joined: 02 Sep 2006
Posts: 6949
Location: Oak Ridge, TN

PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2017 10:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Taste & See KC: Community Christian Church - [0:59]


David
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DRN



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3768
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ

PostPosted: Mon Jul 29, 2019 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bringing this thread forward to post-outage status. Keywords: Community Christian Church , Kansas City.
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Jeff Myers



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1805
Location: Tulsa

PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From In The Nature Of The Materials circa 1941



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SDR



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 17791
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 1940 church in Kansas City bears a resemblance, in building system or at least in material palette---and in the resulting exterior expression---to the 1955 Kalita Humphreys theater in Dallas ?

S
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SDR



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 17791
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, I have to alter that statement; the church was to have been Gunite sprayed over a paper-backed steel wire mesh on steel-framed walls. (We have a similar material, on wood studs, in parts of my 1928 city apartment building.)

The Dallas Theater Center, on the other hand, is a concrete building, according to Storrer ...

S
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DRN



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3768
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Guggenheim was constructed with spray applied concrete as well, shot from the structure's interior into/against plywood forms and later troweled or plastered smooth on the interior face.

The gunite used at the Guggenheim is a dry mix in which water is introduced at the nozzle which allows more time to work the concrete and for work to start and stop without problems of cold joints...(as opposed to shotcrete which is an already wet mix sprayed into or onto formwork).

https://www.guggenheim.org/blogs/checklist/how-one-simple-material-shaped-frank-lloyd-wrights-guggenheim

A pic of Wright at the site with raw concrete being painted:
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-triumph-of-frank-lloyd-wright-132535844/

and

https://www.archdaily.com/874207/the-58-year-evolution-of-frank-lloyd-wrights-guggenheim-museum/594aa0fcb22e38e929000169-the-58-year-evolution-of-frank-lloyd-wrights-guggenheim-museum-photo
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SDR



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 17791
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder where in the building these forms would have been employed:



And, what would have been the form surface applied to these ribs; the shape is a compound curve, so plywood would be out of the question ...

S
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DRN



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3768
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2019 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good question...
I had figured they were some element in the lower level auditorium that I have never been inside. Steiner has a set of construction photos of the lower level, but I'm not seeing a direct match:
http://www.steinerag.com/flw/Books/GuggConst57.htm
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SDR



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 17791
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2019 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks. That ramp and lower-level arcade is news to me, entirely.

Come to that, what could the completed narrow curved forms in the first photo be for ...

S
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loo tee



Joined: 01 Dec 2012
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The original color of the Community Church was pink. After a rainfall, the building looked like it had a skin disease, all splotchy. Eventually, a painting contractor named Jerome Friedson was hired to paint the building white, and he received angry protests from Wright for doing so.
The idea of the church was aborted in the sense that the entire south side--the vast parking terraces and outdoor chapel--were never built. The church was meant to be a kind of drive-in theater during nicer weather, just as the Marin County buildings border on the idea of a suburban shopping mall.
Neither, obviously, was anywhere close to Wright at his best.
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Jeff Myers



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 1805
Location: Tulsa

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wright- ambitious genius who, at times, was stifled by incompetent contractors who failed to see or execute his vision properly.

The community church was not a failure of a Wright design, rather it is a failure of the clients budget, city, and contractor. It still is a gem but Wright was none to pleased with it because the work of art it was to be was tampered by the one who oversaw it being built.

Look to the Price Tower, Beth Shalom, Guggenheim, Ann Pfeiffer chapel as examples of great contractor/architect relationship.
The Price Tower had Haskell Culwell as the contractor, he also contracted on Beth Shalom too. Just thought to throw that note in.

These are just my opinions. I have researched some of Wright’s designs and developed this opinion based on what I have seen scratched in on the plans.
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SDR



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 17791
Location: San Francisco

PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2019 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Couldn't find a photo of the church in pink---so here it is. Too bright, I'm sure; I like the pink/brown shadows.


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