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Ocotillo desert camp recreation
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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Brian for all that helpful information. I'm looking forward to receive the journal.

it isn't possible to include photos in this forum, you have to use an external service like Flickr and add it through a link or if you want you can send it to me by email and I will attach it to this thread through my Flickr account.

Following your criteria I have changed the name of the thread from Ocatilla to Ocotillo, although I know that there is some controversy about this subject.

All those kerosene lanterns under the fabric... The contrast with the "no smoking" sign draws attention
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David Romero
www.hookedonthepast.com


Last edited by David on Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:10 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Craig



Joined: 04 May 2005
Posts: 527
Location: California

PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I assume any electricity would have been produced by some sort of in-house generator rather than via public utility? I agree about not feeling the need to hide the knob and wire in such a structure. Wouldn't lack of insulation on the cable create a potential fire hazard if buried in wood walls?

Perhaps most drafting occurred during normal daylight hours with electric lights used in living quarters after sunset, the end of the work day (5pm or so in the winter).
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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brian has sent me the following picture:



And he add the following text:

Here is a photograph of the interior of George Kastner's cabin at Ocotillo. Note the small stove which belies the idea of the fireplaces that FLlW shows on the presentation plans used in various publications. The photograph was taken by George Kastner in march 1929.
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Last edited by David on Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:06 am; edited 1 time in total
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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Brian, I don't know if this photograph has been published before but it's the first time I see it.

It`s curious to see the reality of the camp outside the professional photographs which usually hide the most mundane details.

One thing that catches my eye is the floor. Did all the cabins have wooden floors? In the Kastner's cabin picture I do not see the boards as I do not see them in the FLLW`s cabin with the piano:




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David Romero
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Last edited by David on Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:32 am; edited 3 times in total
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goffmachine



Joined: 08 Apr 2010
Posts: 219

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have always loved grape nuts.
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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Over what object does the stove rest on? A carpet? A concrete block?
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Roderick Grant



Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 8669

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was wondering the same thing, David. I suspect that none of the floors would be concrete, and any floor that doesn't show its boards was probably covered by linoleum, which was hugely popular in the day. The patch under the stove doesn't look like concrete. It could be a sheet of asbestos? In those days, no one knew how toxic it was. It was all over the place.

I'm going to add Grape Nuts to my shopping list.
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Rood



Joined: 30 Oct 2010
Posts: 1009
Location: Goodyear, AZ 85338

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

David wrote:
Over what object does the stove rest on? A carpet? A concrete block?


Undoubted some kind of sheet metal. Most parlour stoves in turn-of-the-century prairie houses rested on thin panels of sheet-metal.

I'd also guess the wooden floors of the structures at Ocatilla were covered with either linoleum and/or carpets ... if only to keep cold air from seeping through joints of the floor-boards. Arizona can get very cold in winter-time.
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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Linoleum on wood would be a consistent solution with what we see in the photographs. Regarding the color of the said linoleum FLLW usually uses the red color in the floors but in the photos the floor seems very clear to be red. Maybe a light cream color of the same tone as the wood?
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DavidC



Joined: 02 Sep 2006
Posts: 6594
Location: Oak Ridge, TN

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not so certain they would have used linoleum underneath a stove, given it's level of flammability (though, you never know). Perhaps it was some form of metal there?


David
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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, the patch under the stove I agree with Rood that is probably made of metal and looking at the photo it looks like metal.

Rood wrote:
I'd also guess the wooden floors of the structures at Ocatilla were covered with either linoleum and/or carpets ... if only to keep cold air from seeping through joints of the floor-boards. Arizona can get very cold in winter-time.


It seems very likely. I will place then linoleum in the bedrooms (and in the FWLL`s living room) and wood in the rest of the cabins
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Last edited by David on Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JChoate



Joined: 04 Feb 2016
Posts: 923
Location: Atlanta

PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The weatherman says tomorrow night it might snow an inch in Atlanta so, in keeping with the local ritual, all citizens rush to the grocery store to stock up on survival goods.
Having just read the above posts before going to the store, I tossed this in the cart:

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David



Joined: 27 Sep 2016
Posts: 124
Location: Madrid, Spain

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy
I had to look for Grape-Nuts in Wikipedia: "Despite the name, the cereal contains neither grapes nor nuts" Confused

Maybe I can ask for it by Amazon
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goffmachine



Joined: 08 Apr 2010
Posts: 219

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

David, when its time to recreate the box of Grape Nuts..I saw many images on google of old labels so you will be able to find something that works for you. It will look great to see the various items with thier colors and textures brought to life such as the coffee kettles and gas lamps.But above all Im anticipating seeing the navjo Rugs decor matched up with the red and pink of the camp combined with the natural wood and desert background. The color pallet is wonderful. I love the old phone shown in the photo with the piano (many navajo rugs in that photo too)
ps.s to me it looks like a metal sheet below the stove.


Last edited by goffmachine on Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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DRN



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 3603
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ

PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My impression of the camp was shaped by Wright's description of it and the few pictures I initially saw of it. The increasing number of photos show more detail, but I'm skeptical about the use of a "permanent" finish material for a floor in a rustic camp that was to be used for a year or two tops....particularly one that would require glue, rollers, etc. Could a simpler solution have been used? A floor cloth perhaps? Canvas was on site in abundance. Painted or sealed canvas could have been nailed down and stretched over the boards by unskilled labor.

If linoleum was used where did it go? Would the Navajo, who supposedly scavenged the materials after 1929, have peeled up and carried away linoleum? Would they have removed sections of floor whole? Would it have been among the debris seen by Bill Schwarz and friends in 1967?
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