Concrete Floor Help

To control SPAM, you must now be a registered user to post to this Message Board.

EFFECTIVE 14 Nov. 2012 PRIVATE MESSAGING HAS BEEN RE-ENABLED. IF YOU RECEIVE A SUSPICIOUS DO NOT CLICK ON ANY LINKS AND PLEASE REPORT TO THE ADMINISTRATOR FOR FURTHER INVESTIGATION.

This is the Frank Lloyd Wright Building Conservancy's Message Board. Wright enthusiasts can post questions and comments, and other people visiting the site can respond.

You agree not to post any abusive, obscene, vulgar, slanderous, hateful, threatening, *-oriented or any other material that may violate any applicable laws. Doing so may lead to you being immediately and permanently banned (and your service provider being informed). The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. You agree that the webmaster, administrator and moderators of this forum have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic at any time they see fit.
dareninger
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 8:40 am

Concrete Floor Help

Post by dareninger »

Hi,

We are building a LDH and I am looking for a bit of help as we are using concrete radiant flooring but an having trouble finding the best solution for staining the floor FLW red. Staining the concrete before pouring seems to not give the deep red I see in many of FLW designs and almost looks industrial. I have found using a Faded Terracotta acid stain (Scofield) after pouring twice put on for 20 min seems to be the closest but can create a rust/orange coloring.

Anyone have advice on procedure? I understand local conditions such a lime, etc etc, will affect the outcome to some degree. Just looking for a few pointers. :)

Best Regards,

dr

pharding
Posts: 2253
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: River Forest, Illinois
Contact:

Post by pharding »

What is a LDH?
Paul Harding FAIA Restoration Architect for FLW's 1901 E. Arthur Davenport House, 1941 Lloyd Lewis House, 1952 Glore House | www.harding.com | LinkedIn

EJ
Posts: 240
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2005 8:24 pm

Post by EJ »

Life Dream House
"It all goes to show the danger of entrusting anything spiritual to the clergy" - FLLW, on the Chicago Theological Seminary's plans to tear down the Robie House in 1957

outside in
Posts: 1265
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2006 9:02 pm
Location: chicago

Post by outside in »

The concrete with the integral tint does not look the same, you're right, the color is not saturated enough. Instead, use the Scofield "shake on" concrete colorizer/sealer. They have two or three terra cotta colors that are very close to the AC Horn product that FLW use to specify.

The process involves floating the concrete (allowing water to come to the surface) and then broadcasting the iron-oxide sealer/consolidant over the concrete slab - then floating the concrete once more, and reapply. If your concrete contractor has never done this before they should first prepare a sample to get them up to speed and to ensure that it looks right for your approval. After the concrete is dry, apply the tinted liquid sealer recommended by Scofield. Good luck!

Reidy
Posts: 1604
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:30 pm
Location: Fremont CA

Post by Reidy »

I understand that you shouldn't do this in cold weather, or the coloring won't bond properly. When Mildred Rosenbaum was the docent corps at her house, she said this happened to them, and anybody who came in was tracking the tint everywhere. That was how they got Wright's blessing for wall-to-walls.

dareninger
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 8:40 am

Post by dareninger »

outside in wrote: Instead, use the Scofield "shake on" concrete colorizer/sealer. They have two or three terra cotta colors that are very close to the AC Horn product that FLW use to specify.!
Thanks so much for the help. I will review the color's available and run a test. As always thanks for taking the time to respond. I always find such great information in this forum.

Best Regards and have a great weekend... Go Bucks :)

dr

Richard
Posts: 76
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:29 pm
Location: Illinois

Post by Richard »

The Scofield product works very well. I have used it several times.
However, if your concrete contractor has never used this process I would use someone else. If it is done poorly, you have a very expensive mess to correct.

They have to watch drying time, spread the material evenly and also must get the material integrated to a reasonable depth within the top layer of the concrete.

Dying the concrete on the truck is another option which I have never used. Sounds fullproof though and requires no special skill I believe.
Homeowner

dareninger
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 8:40 am

Post by dareninger »

Richard wrote:The Scofield product works very well. I have used it several times.
I find the Acid Stain gives some really nice change in colors.. deep red/dark purple.. but if wrong orange/rust colors. Have you used the acid colors successfully? Do you have recommendations?

I don't believe this contractor has done much with staining indoors. They were surprised I wanted concrete used for most of the flooring in the house. Lord knows the house itself (truss/radius/clerestory windows/radiant floor/foam insulation/shoji doors/solar thermal and PV.. etc etc..) is a challenge at every step.. Yet rewarding!

Again thanks for taking the time to give your input.

DRN
Posts: 4017
Joined: Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:02 am
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ

Post by DRN »

Has anyone recoated a floor, or portions thereof?
At the Sweeton house, the exterior concrete at the front porch and steps, rear terrace, and the basement areaway steps have worn or faded to a "pinkish hue", or in some places, worn down to the aggregate and grey concrete. There are portions of the terrace and areaway steps that were covered by leaves, weed growth, or mud for so long that the original finish, which matches the house interior, is still intact. I'd like to make it all uniform at some point. Can any of the original coatings be reapplied to 60 year old cured material, or do I need to use paint?

I found an original can of the concrete tint behind the plumbing access panel in the trunk room closet (probably toxic waste by now)...I also found some vintage paint stir sticks with the what appears to be the original window paint color, or is it the concrete tint?. I'll take a pic of the can this weekend so it can be posted, for whatever scholarly value it might have.

The access panel was interesting to open, it led to the space behind the tub apron and down into a 24" square by 24" deep pit that has the drain cleanouts; the water supply runs from the basement branch off from this location; and a radiant heat pipe runs through the pit. I saw the slab edge from the pit opening...the red coating is 1/8" to 3/32" thick.

RA
Posts: 178
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 7:10 pm

Post by RA »

The Socfield product we used was a powder which is applied to the wet concrete and worked into the very top layer. It may not be a stain per se. After the concrete cures, a Scofield sealer is applied with a buffing machine. It has been years but I believe that the sealer had the same red tint as the powder. The sealer was to be applied periodically to maintain the finish. If so, one then wonders if the sealer could be used to rejuvinate your concrete. The Scofield red color was close to Cheroke red. You may want to try a small out of the way test patch. Good luck.

Paul Ringstrom
Posts: 4368
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:53 pm
Location: Mason City, IA

Post by Paul Ringstrom »

Here is a product that may be useful in re-coloring exterior concrete. It does not add a texture to the underlying surface.

http://www.concretesolutions.com/spray_ ... _main.html

pharding
Posts: 2253
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: River Forest, Illinois
Contact:

Post by pharding »

As with all topical coating on exterior concrete, issues include maintenance to renew the film and slip resistance when the concrete when the coating is wet.
Paul Harding FAIA Restoration Architect for FLW's 1901 E. Arthur Davenport House, 1941 Lloyd Lewis House, 1952 Glore House | www.harding.com | LinkedIn

pharding
Posts: 2253
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: River Forest, Illinois
Contact:

Post by pharding »

As with all topical coating on exterior concrete, issues include maintenance to renew the film and slip resistance when the concrete when the coating is wet.
Paul Harding FAIA Restoration Architect for FLW's 1901 E. Arthur Davenport House, 1941 Lloyd Lewis House, 1952 Glore House | www.harding.com | LinkedIn

pharding
Posts: 2253
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:19 pm
Location: River Forest, Illinois
Contact:

Post by pharding »

As with all topical coating on exterior concrete, issues include maintenance, adhesion and slip resistance when the concrete with the coating is wet.
Paul Harding FAIA Restoration Architect for FLW's 1901 E. Arthur Davenport House, 1941 Lloyd Lewis House, 1952 Glore House | www.harding.com | LinkedIn

dareninger
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 8:40 am

Post by dareninger »

Paul Ringstrom wrote:Here is a product that may be useful in re-coloring exterior concrete. It does not add a texture to the underlying surface.
Can this be used internally?

Post Reply