Lloyd Lewis sections

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Roderick Grant
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by Roderick Grant »

Yes, SDR, the Getty photo is the master bedroom. The only change is that the seating next to the fireplace in the plan consists of 3 seats, only one of which shows in the photo. The full-length mirror on the closet door might also cause confusion. But in the foreground is a glimpse of the bed and the seat at the end of it as shown in the plan.

An early example of a 'corkscrew' entry is Bach. From the sidewalk to the living room fireplace, one makes 10 ninety-degree turns.

JChoate
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by JChoate »

Tom asked about the red pipe thing, which appeared to be a screened porch enclosure in the 70's -ish photos. Loren Pope house does have a screened porch that is similar in that it's top is also screened, but it's primarily a wood affair. But it does have cool little metal members that form the outer corners. Presumably these metal pieces are just wrapped with the screened. No fasteners needed because it's an outside corner. Quite an effective bit of minimalism.

https://www.google.com/search?q=pope+le ... TPxaxw4VmM

For the bulk of the screened structure, the Pope wood members are suited to receive fasteners. Conversely, I wonder how the old red metal pipe screened porch at Lewis was held together. It looks like those recent (post renovation) photos are screen free. Like Tom says, the remaining red pipe resembles the garden trellises at Taliesin.

g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

I gotta say , the brickwork on Lloyd lewis is rather complex- this is may take on its massing.

entry drive/carport view
Imagell brickwork entry by g dorn, on Flickr

loggia piers
Imagell brickwork terrace by g dorn, on Flickr

bedroom supports
Imagell bedroom brickwork by g dorn, on Flickr
G Dorn
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g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

Floor framing

bedroom wing - the Section drawings suggest ther is 9" I beam, but doesn't say where - so I left it out - does the floor need steel?


Imagell floor framgin bedroom by g dorn, on Flickr

carport steel
Imagell framing carport steel by g dorn, on Flickr

carport timber
again the raftes are cut over the steel such that only 2"of timber are a continuous span for the cantilever- which isn't much anyway - seems to be a typical Taliesin eave detail!

Imagell carport framing by g dorn, on Flickr
G Dorn
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g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

The Section drawings indicate 2 different ways ( it seems to me) of framing the living room floor - even though they indicate all timber 12 x 2 - I suspect some steel was added to stiffen the cantilevers - which I have added in blue. And like in the other Usonians, it seems the fascia joists is doing a lot of the work supporting the cantilevers and tieing it all together.

What is apparent to me, is having a heated floor via hot water pipework - adds complexity to the framing system - I currently fail to see how they accomplished that in these Taliesin drawings - I wonder if a further revised sheet was produced which successfully show a constructable solution!


Below are screen shots of the 2 options shown on the Section drawings


Option A is according to the revised April 1940 Section drawings and also the blueprint sheet 2 "Mat + framing " seems to also indicate.

This option has issues about how the finished floor boards are supported, as the main joists in this version are parallel to the decking! Maybe 6 x 2" blocking was installed to support the decking? There is a note on the Framing plan just above the TERRACE which maybe suggesting something like this. but I can't read it well enough to say exactly .

Does the heating pipework go through all the joists and beams? - what a nightmare for the installer!

on the Workspace Sections - 4 x 2 are used to locate the steel pipework for the floor heating - below the main framing.

Imagell liv floor framing option a by g dorn, on Flickr

long section
Imagell living framing section by g dorn, on Flickr

cross section
Imagell living section op A by g dorn, on Flickr




Option B is the earlier Section which shows 6 x 2" framing - which works better for the finished flooring but has issues to the underlining support- particularly at the junction to the lower dining and entry floor levels.

Imagell liv framing option b by g dorn, on Flickr

section op b
Imagell livng framing opt b section by g dorn, on Flickr

section op b
Imagell living framgin op b section long by g dorn, on Flickr
Last edited by g.dorn on Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
G Dorn
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SDR
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by SDR »

The section drawings would show which direction the joists run, surely ?

One solution to the issue of flooring running parallel to the sub-floor---at right angles to the joists, that is---would be subflooring boards run on the diagonal . . .

I wonder what the attraction for Mr Wright was, to the bi-level living space here and at Willey I.

S

Tom
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by Tom »

JChoate wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:53 pm
Tom asked about the red pipe thing, which appeared to be a screened porch enclosure in the 70's -ish photos. .....
... and there is a sense in which the red pipes would fall in the category of exposed structure.
Centre Pompidou is an extreme example - painted exposed pipes and everything.
It's not the same thing - I know.
But not totally dis-similar either.

GDorn, wow, great work here. Very much appreciated.
It's sure to generate some questions.

juankbedoya
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by juankbedoya »

This one was in my list. But I have seen the same black and white pictures. It seems that it has difficult access. Even the color pictures looks old. Hope some day the owners allow somebody to take new pictures. And if someone has more interior pictures please share us..!! it's a beautiful house, love it..!!

Roderick Grant
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by Roderick Grant »

Juan, an owner of Lewis (most likely former now; he was getting on in age last time I saw him 17 years ago, and not in good health) was not only a Conservancy member, he contributed a significant amount of money to establish a preservation fund. He owned a company that produced decorative street lighting, as I recall. His last name was something like Blair, but I cannot recall that either. John Eifler would know.

At any rate, FLWBC might have some information on unpublished information about the house. Try the resources listed in the home page.

juankbedoya
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by juankbedoya »

Roderick Grant wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:38 pm
Juan, an owner of Lewis (most likely former now; he was getting on in age last time I saw him 17 years ago, and not in good health) was not only a Conservancy member, he contributed a significant amount of money to establish a preservation fund. He owned a company that produced decorative street lighting, as I recall. His last name was something like Blair, but I cannot recall that either. John Eifler would know.

At any rate, FLWBC might have some information on unpublished information about the house. Try the resources listed in the home page.
ok, thanks... I really love this one

g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

kitchen roof framing

you know I think Mr Wrights stepped Usonion board wall system is a bit like modern CLT - Cross Laminated Timber panels

https://www.woodsolutions.com.au/wood-p ... Timber-CLT

the addition of shelving and support posts( for shelving) I image reduces tendency to buckle under loads- although as framing is typically 2" /600 c's - I guess is it reasonably uniformly loaded - (UDL)

Imagell kitchen roof framing by g dorn, on Flickr

dining roof framing and clerestorey - not sure on clerestore framing member size - so these need to be edited once known - but I think the location is correct

Imagell dinginand clerestorey framing by g dorn, on Flickr

entry roof framing and clerestorey
Im not totally sure how the walls work - the photos appear to show a setback or interior shelf over the entry garden - but these seems to class with the entry door - so

Imagell entry and clerestorey roof framing by g dorn, on Flickr

bedroom roof framing

im not sure if I have the number of bays correct - the scanned drawing I used has some distortion- thus the grid goes out of alignment with walls and posts

Imagell bedroomm roof framing by g dorn, on Flickr
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SDR
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by SDR »

Well, I congratulate you for attempting this exploration. Only an architect familiar with each house---perhaps as a restoration specialist---would be able to verify some of your proposals---so it is an act of bravery to take the plunge. I suppose I will have to delve into some photographs to see, for instance, whether I think you've "turned the corner" of that dining-room clerestory correctly. I do know that any Japanese carpenter worth his salt would delight in the way your horizontals there cross---pass through each other in the same plane---at the corner. Not realistic in this case, perhaps---but so much nicer to look at than some of your other non-connected members, in similar situations elsewhere in this and other framing models.

And the stills or screen grabs make dandy images, with their attractive colors and all those wonderful gold and ocher sticks flying about . . .!

Keep em coming. I certainly have no hope of keeping up . . . but it's a pleasure nevertheless---starting with the surprise of the extremely complex brick forms at the top of this page !

S

g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

Living roof framing

Surely there must be a series of sub framing members to support the ceiling boards ?
This screen shot is just showing the main structural members - principal rafters on unit lines - ie 4 ft/1220 c's
Clerestorey framing must have a decent beam in it - as it is supporting the entry roof and the living roof cantilever over! - as well as bracing the internal Usonian steeped wall This might partially explain the large fascia in the photos.

Imagell living roof framing by g dorn, on Flickr
G Dorn
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g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

I didn't notice the the crossed clerestorey framing - im quite a lazy modeller - looking after generals and not doing the details. I guess thats why draftsmen exist!
G Dorn
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g.dorn
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Re: Lloyd Lewis sections

Post by g.dorn »

Using this photo, which seems to show a soffit to entry door which interrupts the bedroom balcony then turns up to become the wall to the stairs, then steps further in to become the high wall to the lantern itself.
there is also some rows of perf boards to the Usonian stepped walls- which also has a stiffening strut.


Image

Anyway, I think I may have decifered how the entry walls+ soffit works.


3D SECTION showing steeped walls and soffits = lower step level with top of guest balcony balustrade
Imagell entry section 2 by g dorn, on Flickr

3D SECTION showing same view as photo - but in b+w to be easier to read.
Image
ll entry soffits by g dorn, on Flickr

Section through steps showing stepped soffits - can see clash with guest balcony level with doors requiring a stepped soffit to provide hieght clearance
Imagell entry section by g dorn, on Flickr



I reckon this arrangement of walls. / soffits is largely an unresolved solution - Im sure Mr Wright would have gone- hmm I need to rethink this! I m sure he would be after nice clean lines = not a series of stepped walls and soffits to provide clearance for the door.

The plan as published in Storrer and Sergeant - don't really indicate this - but if you overlay them, this clash become evident.
G Dorn
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